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Bryan Fischer Says Picking a President is Choosing a Minister of God
more from Hrafnkell Haraldsson
Bryan Fischer, Director of Issues Analysis for the American Family Association (AFA), stumbled into the bad old Dark Ages the other day (and no, it’s not his first trip back). Writing on his personal blog on AFA which speaks only for him and aparently not for the AFA, the man who hates gays, secularists, Muslims, Native Americans, healthy Americans, and a bunch of others we don’t have the space to name, made the claim (as far as we know without blushing) that “when we pick a president, we are in fact choosing a minister of God.”
As such, he sees the “considerable debate” engaged in by Evangelicals over “marital qualifications for public office” as healthy and “a sign of a vigorous community of faith.”
In other words, all the extremist pandering in Iowa I’ve recently spent most every day denouncing, is a good, healthy part of American politics.
I was about to say we might want to spend more time arguing about the candidate’s knowledge of the economy or foreign relations or heck, even the U.S. Constitution, but what was I thinking? It isn’t the Constitution with its prohibition of religious tests or against state-sponsored religion that matters, says Fischer, but the Bible.
Fischer, Johnny-on-the-spot, has anticipated me:
“Those who say that a candidate’s trouble marital past should not be a consideration for values voters are quick to point out that we are choosing a president, not a pastor. The qualifications, they say, are different for pastors than for politicians.”
And they are different, manifestly so. Certainly we want a good character person in the White House just as you’d want one for pastor. But how many times the candidate has been married matters a bit more for a pastor, who, after all, is supposed to morally guide his flock, than for a president, who is supposed to govern a country.
When was the last time a pastor needed to be well-versed in nuclear disarmament protocols or to master the complex machinations of the Pentagon or the grand strategy of the asymmetrical war on terror and two conventional wars besides? How many pastors could have taken out Osama bin Laden?
Here is where all of you who questioned the relevance of Paul of Tarsus in a recent article might take note. Fischer finds the answer “no less than three times in Romans 13” where Paul “uses words that emphasize the sacredness of public service.” Look at the language Paul uses and Fischer eagerly quotes:
“The one who serves in public office is ‘God’s servant’ and the ‘servant of God’ (v. 4), and statesmen are ‘ministers of God’ (v. 6).
Thus, claims Fischer in a eureka-moment, “if in fact we allow the Scriptures to be our guide, then public service is a form of ministry. One who holds public office is serving in a divinely ordained role, just as much as a pastor in the pulpit. The role of a statesman is every bit as sacred as that of a clergyman.”
Sacredly ordained…I think Bryan Fischer just rediscovered the divine right of kings – and a neat segue into the GOP principal that God chooses our presidents for us since we are a divinely sanctioned nation. And sure enough, there it is:
“[T]here is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God.”
Therefore, says Fischer, pounding his point home, “Every politician, whether he knows it or not, is using delegated power, delegated authority, authority delegated to him by God himself.”
Not, significantly, delegated by the Constitution, which in fact established our political offices. It is the will of the people – we the people – who hold the reins in the United States – not God, not the Bible, not the will of men pretending to do God’s will. Remember how I suggested perhaps a president should have a working knowledge of the Constitution? That goes doubly for Bryan Fischer, the guy who thinks the Establishment Clause established Christianity as the state religion rather than forbidding that establishment, and who as a result, perhaps, should stick to ministering.
Even if we go back in time to the days when Paul wrote (the first century C.E.), his insights would no doubt have startled the Romans as much as any constitutionally-minded American, given that their institutions were ancient and unique and established in the distant polytheistic past in central Italy, not by a small group of rabid monotheists in Judaea. I bet Caesar didn’t know he was serving “God” when he became consul. I’m certain he thought he was serving the Senate and the People of Rome – and maybe himself (but that’s true of every office holder throughout history).
The idea that God controls all human affairs and takes a direct hand in them through agents on earth is an ancient one. The mantle rested lightly in the days before God started telling people how to act, much less so afterward. The Jewish priesthood in post-monarchical Israel claimed to be governing Israel for the true King (God) and we all know how Jesus felt about that; and we are all well aware of the horrors perpetrated on humanity by European king after European king pretending to stand in for God on earth. Any horror can be perpetrated when one claims divine sanction. Hitler even declared divine sanction in the form of “providence” (a term also much used by Christianity).
History teaches us, even if you choose like Fischer to ignore the U.S. Constitution, that sane people ought to be running away from the idea that elected officials serve God before they serve their constituents. The Founding Fathers ran away from that idea by eliminating (or so they thought) the possibility of state-sponsored religion and religious tests for office, by leaving out all mention of God, Jesus, Bible (including the aforementioned Paul) and divine right out of the Constitution.
Yet again and again religious conservatives circle the argument around to God and the Bible and leave the Constitution out of it, unless pretending the Constitution is actually based on the Ten Commandments (leaving you to wonder if they have read either document). “Values voters” are certainly free to vote their conscience in 2012 – the Constitution (not the Bible) guarantees them this right. But all the “faith” in the world cannot change the wording of that document or make Paul ‘s nattering relevant to the political process established by it.
Ultimate authority derives not from God, not through some outdated concept of divine sanction, but from the people, and a voter’s first concern should be in choosing the candidate who best serves the interest not of God but of the people. Leave issues of morality to those best able to hypocritize them – ministers like Bryan Fischer.
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SinghX
Dec. 29th, 2011 at 8:44 am
Bryan, Bryan, Bryan…such a little phisher. He lives in a country that is bound by law to tolerate his hypocrisy, yet he wants that very same tolerance destroyed so that his “chosen” people have divine right to rule.
Sigh…maybe we should stop tolerating “Bryan the little phisher” in the same fashion as the people in the little town of Beit Shemesh, Israel. Their religious/secular communities stood side by side demanding that the extremist religious orthodox (fundamentalist) obey the secular law of the Israel.
We should stand in solidarity with these folks, perhaps our own “occupy movement” in protest of religious fundamentalist in America…if we don’t we will be force into the same problems as Israel, the Arab countries, ect.
SusanD
Dec. 29th, 2011 at 4:30 pm
I could not agree with you more. I have written a series on this subject. You can google it at Coalition of Church and State or find it on Planet POV. I am sure you will find it interesting since you seem to understand exactly what these people are after.
Wes
Dec. 29th, 2011 at 10:53 am
In 1st Century Rome, being Caesar was a “divine appointment”, and his titles included “Lord, Son of God” reflecting his appointment by the gods to his position. When Paul applied those titles to Jesus, he committed treason and that’s why he was taken to Rome and executed. The idea that Caesar honestly thought that he was serving the people is nutty – the job was usually won by military conquest, political intrigue and strategic assassinations.
Aside from that, I agree that Fischer is a dangerous nutcase.
Hrafnkell Haraldsson
Dec. 29th, 2011 at 11:46 am
That’s not true with regards to first century Rome. There is quite a bit of difference between the Pagan Romans and the later Christian Romans.
Further, these ideas developed over time. “Caesar” went from being a cognomen (nickname), one that the first emperor, Octavian, inherited from his uncle legally, to a title given to the emperor-designate by the end of the first century – nothing divine about the name at all.
By the fourth century tetrarchy, “Caesar” was the title of the junior emperor under a senior emperor designated “Augustus.” These were not divine appointments but very earthly appointments made not by a god but by men.
Augustus was hailed as messiah well before Jesus’ birth and spoken of in language later reproduced in the New Testament writings but directed then at Jesus.
As for Paul, there is no evidence, as I have argued here before, that Paul was executed for anything, and his arrest was originally for violating Jewish, not Roman law. The Jews accused him of stirring up trouble, of sedition. Sedition, rioting – not for applying those titles to Jesus.The Jews continued to press the governor for jurisdiction in the case. In the end of course, we are told, Paul was sent to Rome, there to disappear from history after living it up in the ‘burbs.
Finally, I cannot agree that it is nutty to think that Caesar thought he was serving the people. The people certainly loved Caesar, whatever his varied motivations might have been. There is no way to judge at this point Caesar’s devotion to the idea of the Roman state. That he though he was best placed to promote it makes him no different than any president we have had; it does not require that he despise the people or the state.
A Walkaway
Dec. 29th, 2011 at 11:20 am
The Bible also says that one is supposed to obey Authority and be submissive to them because they represent God. Well, in that case, the US was founded in rebellion against God (sin) because the colonists rebelled against the King of England.
I know the counter-argument, that the King of England abrogated his responsibility to the colonists and thus they were justified in rebelling. The problem is, there is no provision for a King (or minister) not being responsible. The Bible teaches that people are responsible for their actions and decisions, irregardless of the actions of others (or so the fundies/dominionists teach).
It’s not what they practice, but it is exactly what they teach (or at least taught when I belonged to those types of churches) and what they expect of those lower on their ‘chain of being’.
I would ask that jackass Phisher why he’s so patriotic towards the United States and not advocating returning to submission to the English Crown, if he’s going to think that way. He’s supporting a country founded in Sin, if you fully apply their reasoning (in that I would agree, but not because of their reasoning).
I would love to see “Occupy Churches”… fighting against fundamentalism in every form. However, as bad as the Occupy movement has been treated, it would be nothing compared to the hate and treatment the fundies would meet out if we tried to Occupy them. I think the violence would ramp up to genocidal levels.
Shiva (Moderator)
Dec. 29th, 2011 at 11:41 am
I’m betting that Mr. Fisher thinks that all Christians would love to live in a country that appears to be more like heaven than the one they have.
Unfortunately there is not a single GOP candidate right now that you can think of as godly. the only people who think they are serving God as God’s representative in government are those who would seek to grab all the power and control the people’s lives
Reynardine
Dec. 30th, 2011 at 8:17 am
Oh, they’re Godly…they all think they ARE God.
Jim Faubel
Dec. 29th, 2011 at 2:14 pm
One might be more favorably inclined to accept the idea that God chooses our Presidents if He hadn’t done such an abysmally poor job of choosing His ministers – people like Bryan Fischer, Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, etc. etc. etc.
Reynardine
Dec. 29th, 2011 at 2:25 pm
I’d agree with Singh: these people are quite capable of genocide.
SinghX
Dec. 29th, 2011 at 3:41 pm
I think you meant “Walkaway’, but, I concur. They are capable of pulling triggers in the name of the sky-god because they have already been primed by cult indoctrination via their ministries and media outlets. However, when push comes to shove, they usually destroy themselves (sometimes a law enforcer). There is no doubt in my mind that somewhere, in some little town, some minister is frightening the flock asking them if they will defend Jesus by shooting his “enemy” as the are’a'comin’ta’get’cha!
As stated in my past comments, the fundamentalist XXXtreme-evans have had no martyrs or miracles by which they can claim religious supremacy, nor, mainstream status. Koolaide drinker churches, like Jim Jones followers, would probably be more in line with mass suicide as their “genocide” because they would become martyrs. No one will sympathize with them if they start firing on innocent people whom the XXXtremes see as possessed by Satan. Killing the “Satan” because people are gay, disobedient, abortionist would be their only defense…we all know how those cases end.
I’m pretty sure Bryan the little phisher knows that fact because he has a staff of “attorney’s” who tell him not to say certain things in public because they could be taken as inciting Sedition or Treason…
(Americans need to show solidarity by have a “protest movement” like the Israelis, not necessarily “occupy”…sorry, wrong term).
Churchlady
Dec. 30th, 2011 at 1:01 am
At the core of this “belief” (I give the benefit of the doubt that he actually believes anything at all) lies the drumbeat that “Christianity is under attack and is being threatened by eradication.”
Nope. Been around 2000-plus years. Not in danger at all. Frankly, that shows scant faith, IMHO. Did any Christian get barred from Christmas services? Nope. Can you and your kids and mother-in-law pray anywhere you want? Yup. Can you stand on street corners and holler about Romans and Leviticus and what-have-you without being busted? Another yup. Can you build your church, go to Sunday School, have your Wednesday night prayer meeting, and even handle snakes in Estill Springs, TN all without any interference at ALL? Another big YUP.
What these bozos get their knickers in a twist over is the stubborn refusal of many of us, including fellow Christians, to let them use the taxpayer supported institutions of government and the military to propagate their views of Christianity. THAT – forbidden by the Constitution and long honored in this diverse nation – is the reason they believe they are “being persecuted”. That they may freely worship and speak and evangelize and proselytize is not enough. Nope. They want you to HAVE TO LISTEN as they preach their creed in taxpayer supported public spaces.
Freedom of religion is for them and only them – and YOU are suppose to pay for it.
Sorry, Mr. Fisher – NO! We do not pick God’s holy servant for president. We pick a president who protects all our rights, and one of them is to free NOT to listen to YOU, not to have your warped idea of Old Testament law shoved down our throats, and not to heed your dubious ideas of God and Jesus – or Jesus at all if we are not Christians.
That’s precisely what keeps YOU free, Mr. Fisher. Do as you please – but not on or in or through government institutions. I am a taxpayer, and MY religious freedom involves not heeding you and what you think. That’s not persecuting YOU at all. So get over yourself – you are not a martyr, and you are free to go about your business doing what you want. Just don’t ask any of us to pay for it, especially in the selection of a president.
SinghX
Dec. 30th, 2011 at 7:57 am
Excellent! Bingo! Right on my funk-soul-sista’! I’m doing the “Church lady” dance on the coffee table, yes’um!
…now, if we could just corner this cretin, (put a spoonful of peanut butter in his mouth so he can’t talk) and read this to him before cameras in a crowded place, maybe, just maybe the media would play it or it would go viral on Youtube…sigh…I’m a dreamer…
wiscogal
Dec. 30th, 2011 at 8:08 am
Could not have stated my feelings more eloquently Churchlady!
Reynardine
Dec. 30th, 2011 at 8:56 am
I can just see Mr. Fischer’s next rant: Plastic surgery is a sin! God picks your nose!
A Walkaway
Dec. 30th, 2011 at 11:44 am
(Laugh!) Yeah (that would be accurate knowing the things they believe), but they won’t carry that forward to one’s sexual orientation.
After all, they think God has declared homosexuals to be especially disgusting. They don’t realize the word used means “ritually impure” for the old Jewish religion and way of worship.