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Religious Right Claims If We Allow Gay Marriage We Are Persecuting Christians
By: Hrafnkell HaraldssonMay. 9th, 2013more from Hrafnkell Haraldsson

Well, we’ve seen already how stupid the cries of persecution are. I’m sorry Rev. Creech is upset that we have had the audacity to say no to his intolerance, but the First Amendment says he’s going to have to find a way to cope.
This “descent into Paganism” he laments is what I would call a “Pagan Renaissance.” The Polytheistic world was tolerant of all religions for the simple reason that all gods were known to exist. Jan Assmann calls polytheism a means of translation between cultures, an “ecumene of interconnected nations.”
Before monotheism, there was no true/false dynamic in religion. As Assmann puts it, “The different peoples worshipped different gods, but nobody contested the reality of foreign gods and the legitimacy of foreign forms of worship.”[1]
Of course, this source of religious pluralism is what conservative Christians most fear. Thus the “descent” into what can only be considered a good thing for most people because it undoes the evil created by the Old Testament’s anti-Gentilism whereby everyone who was not one of the Chosen People became, in effect, to use Jesus’ own words, a dog or a swine (Matthew 7:6). As Bart Ehrman writes, “Basic tolerance was one of the central aspects of ancient Greco-Roman religion”[2] thus any “descent” into Paganism brings with it a renewal of religious tolerance. We can’t have that, people like Creech are saying. It frankly terrifies them.
I wrote the other day about the anti-Pagan diatribe that is the Old Testament, which is the product of what Assmann calls “‘counter-religion” because it rejects and repudiates everything that went before and what is outside itself as ‘paganism.’”[3] The true/false distinction turned the world upside down: “the new counter-religion blocked intercultural translatability. False gods cannot be translated.”[4] Christianity not only claimed to be the religion of a new chosen people, but it picked up this intolerant baggage, carried it with it for twenty centuries, and has been actively persecuting people on account of it for seventeen centuries, including, especially, the original chosen people.
The consequences should be obvious to all: homosexuality is something Pagans “do.” Thus a culture that tolerates homosexuality is Pagan and one which promotes it is in open rebellion against their God. The god they insist, whether we want him or not, is our God – our only god – too. God destroyed Israel for its sins and so it only stands to reason he will destroy his new Israel full of his new chosen people: America. You can readily see why people like Rev. Creech have become completely unhinged.
So Creech did the only thing he could do: he got on his big martyr bandstand and started pointing fingers so God would know who to smite:
These events of late prove, without question, that the normalization of homosexual behavior in the culture and the legalization of same-sex marriage will inevitably usher in a flood of religious persecutions for Christians who dare say homosexuality is a sin. Touting as they have that gay rights are about civil rights, the LGBT community deceives the public into believing every born-again, God fearing, Bible-believing, follower of Jesus Christ is worse than an prejudiced Archie Bunker type idiot.
Okay, marriage equality does not prove any such thing since there is nothing in the historical record which shows a culture tolerating homosexuality persecuting non-homosexuals. Giving everybody the same rights is not persecution. Freeing everybody to worship and believe as they will means, necessarily, freeing them of the constraints of others who believe differently.
Christians are and will continue to be free to say homosexuality is a sin, even though homosexuality is a pathology that has been with us only since the 19th century, and even though the Church was not particularly ill-disposed toward homosexuality for most of its history. The thing is, and Rev. Creech really very clearly hates this, the rest of us are and will continue to be free to object to Creech’s religion-based bigotry.
As I wrote here the other day, conservative Christians want to be able to hate without consequence. As for Archie Bunker, if the shoe fits…
But Creech has more whining to do:
Unfortunately, very few people understand why such persecution is inevitable for those who would reject same-sex marriage. The reason is because the legalization of gay marriage doesn’t simply facilitate the ability of homosexuals to marry along-side of heterosexuals; instead it legally redefines the institution of marriage for everyone. No longer is marriage between a man and a woman, but between two adults – regardless of gender. Therefore, this presents a radically different paradigm resulting in a myriad of societal conflicts that government uses its broad enforcement authority to resolve. In other words, if citizen Christians with small businesses or Christian organizations and ministries are unwilling to comply with this new legal orthodoxy on marriage, then such are outside of the law and vulnerable to the government’s coercive powers to bring them into compliance.
This is just hilarious. It’s perfectly okay, Creech is saying, for Christians to use government’s coercive powers to force us into a Christian paradigm. He’s all cool with that and why wouldn’t he be? It’s been the Church’s modus operandi for seventeen hundred years, since the publication of the Theodosian Code. But gods forbid other people have a right to paradigms of their own. That hasn’t been possible for most of the Common Era thanks to bigots like Creech, not since the days of polytheism, in fact.
But Creech isn’t done with his fantasy yet:
For many years, Christians in this country – one largely based on Christian values – have had it relatively easy and not experienced serious bouts with persecution. But that may soon change if America continues its rapid decline into paganism.
Serious bouts of persecution? Really? Really? How about, oh…I dunno…NONE? Who has persecuted Christians in America since the Constitution was signed? And all the persecution before this and any after, were examples of Christians persecuting other Christians. Rev. Creech needs to get a grip.
Don’t be fooled. True Christianity is in no way compatible with homosexuality. And same-sex marriage is in no way compatible with religious liberty.
Yet, somehow denying religious liberty IS religious liberty? Oh dear…. This is a real testicle-twister. Wrong, wrong, wrong, Creech old chum! Religious liberty means more than the rights of Christians to religious liberty. It means religious liberty for everybody, like the Constitution intended. You remember…the First Amendment? You may have heard of it. It means the rest of us are not bound by your ideas of morality, which, as science has shown, did not come from your god or any god. Get over the idea that you have exclusive claim to morality. You don’t. You never did.
Creech saves his real hyperbole for the conclusion of his rant:
This writer is not conceding to the so-called inevitability of gay marriage. But his point is that regardless of what happens on that front, every genuine believer must always like Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego, purpose in his heart that he will not bow down to Nebuchadnezzar’s image.
Oh wow, Nebuchadnezzar? Really? I really don’t think there are too many images of Nebuchadnezzar you need to worry about, Rev. Creech. This image doesn’t even work metaphorically.
Keep your highly bigoted version of Christianity. Please. Fewer and fewer people want it. But if you insist on continuing this promiscuous spewing of hate, expect some return on that investment, and not just in numbers of young people leaving the Church, because we “Pagans” have a right to opinions too, and we do intend to express them most strenuously.
[1] Jan Assmann. Moses the Egyptian: The Memory of Egypt in Western Monotheism. (Cambridge, MA: Harvard University Press, 1993), 3.
[2] Bart D. Ehrman. The New Testament: A Historical Introduction to the Early Christian Writings. Third Ed. (New York, NY: Oxford University Press, 2004), 30.
[3] Assmann (1993), 3.
[4] Assmann (1993), 3.
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J. Mark Danley
May. 9th, 2013 at 9:12 pm
Oh, fer… STOP! JUST F@#KING STOP! STOP trying to turn yourselves into VICTIMS just because the tide of opinion has turned AGAINST you. ADAPT! LEARN! Or fade into OBLIVION…
KEVIN HURST
May. 9th, 2013 at 11:47 pm
first of all we do not allow anything we are all creations of the all mighty god , to make that statement exudes extreme arrogance . it is not our place to make a judgement on anyone’s life style if there is to be a judgement to be made it certainly is not ours , and to feel that we have the authority to make a judgement is a sin in itself and sin is sin , judge not lest ye be judged it is an arrogant sin to feel that we have the right to make that call for god , live and let live and love and let love and leave the judging to god . learn to love your fellow man regardless of what societal rules try to dictate .
jeff
May. 9th, 2013 at 9:21 pm
the most offensive thing about this is that he assumes all Christians believe the way he does. and that if they don’t they’re not “real” Christians. and that, folks actually IS religious persecution……
chris pelham
May. 9th, 2013 at 9:23 pm
Just shut up you GD preacher fraud. We’re so GD tired of hearing about all you poor old (white) oppressed Christian(ist) (extremist nutjobs) Prepare to RIH you hypocrite fools.
Paws
May. 9th, 2013 at 9:33 pm
How does marriage equality redefine marriage for everyone, as he alleges? It does no such thing. If you want to marry someone of the opposite sex, then marry that person. If you want to marry someone of the same sex, then marry that person.
The “institution” of marriage is one of love and commitment between two people who love each other. Obtaining a marriage license and taking the vows – whether in a church, at a court house, or anywhere else – makes the marriage contract between two people legal.
You cannot exclude part of the population from this legal contract. Doing so sets up an unequal condition that cannot continue.
Either we are ALL equal under the law – or we are not.
Shiva
May. 9th, 2013 at 9:44 pm
Religion used as conservatism. Oh poor meeeeeeeee. I don’t mind reading this because it fortify s my belief there are no gods and if there were, they wouldn’t be here.
knight4444
May. 9th, 2013 at 10:08 pm
The religious RIGHT! OMG! what a contradiction of terms!! it’s hilarious how conservatives publicly scream and shout “GAY PEOPLE ARE FREAKS” “THEY’LL BURN IN HELL!” but when it’s all said and done, these same conservative men somehow always get busted giving a gay man a B,J. or MORE! then going to the philippines trolling for little boys in the sex trade!! Watch out Manila!, fat BAST*RD! limbaugh has plenty of free time upcoming!! YUK!!
Joshua Crime
May. 9th, 2013 at 10:16 pm
He has no idea what persecution is. If the moron Christians keep it up, we’ll show them what being persecuted means by using the methods proscribed by their own historical witch trials against them.
I mean, really. The Appian Way used to be lit with the bodies of impaled Christians. We could go back to that if the fat overprivileged conservative Christian right think they are being persecuted.
What a bunch of lying bloviating lickspittles.
Gary
May. 10th, 2013 at 1:00 am
Wasn’t it those same christians that stole the pagan rituals like decorating a tree and Eastar?
knight4444
May. 10th, 2013 at 1:10 am
YEP. if I’m correct it was emperor Constantine that helped christianity spend in Rome. BTW , it was for political reasons!!
ARWKoppen
May. 10th, 2013 at 6:13 am
Let those gays do; it’s their right, USA has already signed:
www.un.org/en/documents/u...
j
May. 10th, 2013 at 7:33 am
The bible was written over the ages by a bunch of assorted old men, they all put their own spin on it!
How about the part in the bible that says if a man marries a woman she must be a virgin, if she is not a virgin she must be executed.
Mary James
May. 10th, 2013 at 10:17 am
FAKE CHRISTIANS They are pathetic mindless souless who love to cry what victims they are. They live in their delusional world where only fake christian’s go to haven.
Just A Dumb Fireman
May. 10th, 2013 at 10:44 am
“… every born-again, God fearing, Bible-believing, follower of Jesus Christ is worse than a prejudiced Archie Bunker type idiot.”
Sorry, Creech – if the shoe fits, wear it.
(WHERE do they get names like “Creech” from? The South is one giant caricature).
knight4444
May. 10th, 2013 at 12:28 pm
@Dumb fireman, your blanket statement about ALL christians is not helpful to this site. For many christians we view the ”religous right” as a political tool being used by the GOP. I agree with about 90% of your opinions here, but this post is going OVER BOARD.
Jim Faubel
May. 10th, 2013 at 12:04 pm
How dare America not kowtow to the dictates of our primitive bronze-age Patriarchal God.
Please note that the Bible only condemns sex between men and never condemns sex between women. Ancient Patriarchs believed that only men had the “magic seed” (sperm) that produces life and it was therefore wasteful to use it for any purpose that doesn’t make babies.
Joe V.
May. 10th, 2013 at 1:07 pm
I’d like to slug this rat-fuck bigot in the face until he loses all of his teeth. People like him are the reason I was abused and bullied so badly as a kid. Why I wonder do people like his kind act so surprised when they are met with violence from those that oppose him.
Cheryl
May. 10th, 2013 at 2:28 pm
I live in North Carolina, and I am a Democrat. Mr. Creech should realize that hes not the only one who can read the Bible. The Right wing idiots seem to read it differently than the rest of us. They seem to have forgotten about Matthew 7:1,2 Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgement, ye shall be judgeed: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be Maesured to you again. How about Leviticus 19:18 Thou shalt not aveng, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.Now I am not a rev. or theology student, however I can read, and I do own a Bible. These “christians” seem to beleive that Jesus would have approved of their ways. He was not a rich man,a corporation, or a right wingnut. I am a Christian and I believe in tolerance and religous freedoms. Mr. Creech needs to read his Bible again.
jeff
May. 11th, 2013 at 9:36 am
Personally, I think it’s time we reclaim God from the forces of evil. The bible says beware of false prophets, you will know them by their actions. And the actions I am seeing do not match the Jesus I read about in the bible.
What has bothered me for at least 25 years is that to some, doing good works is overshadowed by an oath they took to believe, and that to them anything is OK as long as they do it in God’s name.
knight4444
May. 11th, 2013 at 10:02 am
@Jeff, I could agree with you more! I’ve been saying the same thing here over and over again. Republicans who claim to be christians ”typically” aren’t. Many of my liberal friends here keep believing the religious right speaks for ALL christians, they don’t! they speak for a group of political opportunist and should be exposed!
lm945
May. 10th, 2013 at 4:46 pm
I thought the Right only believed in the 2nd Amendment?
James
May. 11th, 2013 at 10:25 am
FACT: Paganism is protected by the First Amendment at EXACTLY the same level as Christianity. If the nation chooses to embrace Paganism, that is our Constitutional RIGHT.
Quit trying to put your religion over others.
Blessed be.
Dave
May. 11th, 2013 at 10:37 am
I’m open to believing every born-again, God fearing, Bible-believing, follower of Jesus Christ is worse than an prejudiced Archie Bunker type idiot. Especially when so many of them speak and ACT that way.
Mark P. Kessinger
May. 11th, 2013 at 1:00 pm
[1 of 2]
Writes Mr. Haraldsson:
Excuse me?? A pathology? Does Haraldsoon really not know of the sordid history of the medical profession in its attempts to “treat” homosexuality? The word ‘pathology’ has more than one meaning, to be sure, but none of those definitions are defensible in this context. Gay people are not persons suffering with a malady or disease known as “homosexuality.” Nor is our sexual orientation a “deviation” from the proper form of sexuality (another definition of ‘pathology’). IT is a normal variation within the range of human sexual expression.
[cont'd]
Mark P. Kessinger
May. 11th, 2013 at 1:04 pm
[2 of 2]
As for the claim that homosexuality has “only been with us since the 19th C.,” that is an outrageou8sly unsupportable claim. Perhaps the word was coined in the 19th C. but the phenomenon of men who are sexually attracted primarily to men, and women who are sexually attracted primarily to women, has been with us throughout human history. Whether it was specifically recognized or defined is subject to dispute.
I realize Haraldsson was trying to be supportive of the LGBT community with this post. But frankly, with friends like this . . .
knight4444
May. 11th, 2013 at 2:32 pm
Homosexuality has been around since humans learned to walk upright! I pay little attention to the religious right! their typically very simple minded individuals, just look at Pat Robertson!