Inaction In the Bundy Standoff Legitimizes Anti-Government Sedition In Montana

Montana Mine Militiaman
There is an aphorism, likely from an archaic proverb, that was first used in 1846 America by pacifist and abolitionist Adin Ballou that says “might makes right.” The entire quote is, “But now, instead of discussion and argument, brute force rises up to the rescue of discomfited error, and crushes truth and right into the dust. Might makes right.”

Throughout world history, civilized society’s remedy for a barbaric concept such as “might makes right” has been establishing laws and statutes to maintain a semblance of order without bullies using brute force to impose their will on a culture or to “crush truth and right into the dust.” Obviously, Republicans embrace the concept of ‘might makes right’ and it informs their bloodlust for war as well as their support for sedition against the United States.

In most Western Republicans states, on orders from the billionaire Koch brothers, governors and state legislatures have been on a crusade to seize federal land to sell to logging, mining, and fossil fuel industries. According to Republicans, the federal government has no right to own any land they say belongs to the states; it was the argument proffered by racist rancher Cliven Bundy a little over a year ago. Since Republican states have been unsuccessful, thus far, in forcing the federal government to cede its authority over, and ownership of, federal land including national parks, there have been two incidents where “might makes right” ruled the day.

As reported here yesterday, another group of armed militiamen have prohibited federal employees from doing their jobs by force of arms in Montana. The issue is centered around two miners thumbing their noses at federal laws, and the government, with armed resistance not unlike Cliven Bundy’s seditious actions in Nevada. Because armed Oath Keepers, 3% of Idaho, and Pacific Patriot Network answered a call to arms against the government, federal prosecutors were ‘forced’ to file suit to allow Forest Service employees to gain access to Forest Service land the armed militias have closed off and prohibited entrance to. The Oath Keepers said they were summoned to action by “the miners and called for reinforcements to protect the miners from ‘any illegal’ Forest Service activity.” Illegal Forest Service activity in Oath Keeper’s minds is federal employees doing their appointed duties on federal Forest Service land.

The federal prosecutors “had to ask” a court to “please tell” the two miners and their little army to “please stop” blocking access to public land and “kindly stop” using armed bullies to threaten federal government officials in the commission of their jobs. Since there is no law or statute that allows the miners to close access to public land, destroy public property, or illegally open a road, the miners summoned armed militias to prove that might make right and laws are irrelevant.

In Republican circles the miners and their small army are courageous patriots standing up to the nasty federal government, but according to the law established in the U.S. Code they are committing sedition; not that Republicans or their precious patriot militias acknowledge federal law any more than they do the legality of the federal government.

It is stunning that federal prosecutors had to beg a judge to make the armed bullies stop preventing federal officials from performing their jobs, or preventing citizens from accessing public land. The federal government has every right to arrest the miners and their armed militia, just like it did Bundy and his army, for seditious conspiracy; calling on a court for assistance was not only unnecessary, it sends the wrong message to the armed conspirators.

According to 18 U.S. Code § 2384, it is consideredseditious conspiracy if two or more persons in any State or Territory, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, conspire to oppose by force the federal government authority, or by force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States, or by force to seize, take, or possess any property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof. They shall each be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both.” Also in 18 U.S. Code § 2383, Rebellion or insurrection, “Whoever incites, sets on foot, assists, or engages in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the United States or the laws thereof, or gives aid or comfort thereto, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both.”

It is beyond refute that when the two Montana miners, or Cliven Bundy for that matter, summoned armed militias to “oppose by force, or by force prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law, or seize, take, or possess any property of the United States” they were guilty of both seditious conspiracy and rebellion; according to the U.S. Code. However, might makes right in America and it is why neither Bundy, his armed conspirators, nor the Montana miners will suffer any consequences.

The federal government is setting – correction, has already set – a very dangerous precedent in allowing seditious conspirators free rein flout federal laws they disagree with. Republicans, for their part, are guilty of “inciting” insurrection against the authority of the United States by heralding the patriotism of armed militias and crowing that the federal government has no legal right to its own land. In fact, in every Republican-led Western state, and to a lesser degree in Congress, GOP representatives are actively promoting the idea that states are well within their purview to take over federal land.

By all accounts, the Montana miners have seized, taken, and possessed property of the United States and instead of arresting them and their army, federal prosecutors ‘asked a judge’ to make them stop it, pay for property they destroyed, and please allow Forest Service officials to do their jobs. It is sending a signal to the Koch brothers that instead of spending tens-of-millions of dollars to pass state or federal laws forcing the government to hand over its public land for logging, mining, and oil drilling, all they have to do is take over the land, start logging, mining, and drilling for oil and hire armed mercenaries to “oppose by force” federal authorities “enforcing the laws of the United States.”

It is true that no-one except anti-government militias want bloodshed to start their precious 2nd revolution, but at some juncture the federal government has to either make a stand and enforce the law like a civilized society, or cede all authority to armed militias and allow America to complete devolve and collapse into a land where might, and white, makes right. There would be a different outcome, and an instantaneous bloodbath, if African Americans dared oppose the government or seize federal land whether they had guns or not.

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85 Replies to “Inaction In the Bundy Standoff Legitimizes Anti-Government Sedition In Montana”

  1. If we shoot the all too deserving of such, then they’ll be Martyrs. And like their spiritual cohorts in ISIS- they’ll use such to gain more followers.

    The best thing we can do is keep it in perspective.

    It’s a mine, that’s being improperly utilized.
    Namely- toxic waste. Let the Oath Kreepers hang out amongst that crap all they want- I say.

    Eventually like Craven Bundy’s antics, the wannabe Dirty Harry-ies will have to go home and tend to their own.

    All the Feds have to do- is out stubborn them.

    What we don’t need is another Waco. Which inevitably led to the Murrah Building bombing in OKC.

  2. The Republicans, the Kochs, the NRA-all are complicit in raising the presence of Right Wing militias and giving them legitimacy in the eyes of their base. Since Pres. Obama’s election, the trio of hate has fed the innate “fear of the black man’ in their rabid followers. This armed rabble has been raised to the level of a ‘Last Defense’ against the President and the policies they oppose, most of which are tin foil hat conspiracies. They’re equated with the colonial patriots and Founders who had a worthy cause, not an ammosexual’s wet dream. If federal workers or soldiers are injured by these halfwit heroes, the Republicans should be called out by the rest of America for their part in it.

  3. Agree we cannot have another Waco. But we should sue them and take every dime they ever had or ever hope to have and leave them to rot.

  4. In my opinion, before this starts to get out of control, the federal government should issue a warning and if not heeded, should issue arrest warrents for anyone still present. Once issued, the warrents should be carried out by force if necessary. This sedition must be nipped in the bud NOW. Too many of these groups parading around as militias intimidating government employees and the public have got to be made to realize they’ve got to stop or this BS will continue. You mentioned Republicans inciting this behavior. Let’s not leave out the responsibility of Fox “News” and other right wing hate spewers.

  5. Their strategy, being run through the brainless by a certain central brain, is to incite insurrection until martial law must be imposed *before the election*, which they will use to either sway or invalidate the election. If the federal government doesn’t bite, they’ll use their goondahs to prevent the “wrong” people from voting and/or seize the “wrong” ballots, and then have the Justitutes ratify the results.

  6. The photo shows an alleged MAN with the words US Patriot..he is anything but a “patriot” He knows NOTHING about being Patriotic he knows only his own bloodthirsty need to kill anyone who does not look like him, think like him or who does not bend to his sick arrogant ignorant demands. If these “patriots” were Native American, Black or Hispanic then they would have already been Demonized and then neutralized by the Conservative Christian Reich Wing! These militant traitors MUST be eliminated at all cost! Their semi automatic penises should be confiscated for our safety and security.

  7. The Weather Forecast for Lincoln Montana:
    http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/getForecast?query=Lincoln+Montana

    Where the White Hope mine is near. Forecasting High Wind Watch, Fire Warning, and a possibility of a Thunderstorm.
    Fun Times. A bunch of overstewed Boy Scouts hanging around in a dry forest during a Thunderstorm- carrying metal and explosives.

    The Government does not need to act like the Republicans with the Iran Act.

    What the hell happened to the notion of non-military diplomacy?

    Does anyone remember the result of Craven Bundy’s SNAFU? Oh yeah- he’s faded away from the limelight. No rallying cries about him and his beef.

    His Attention-Whoring Defenders got damned tired of hanging out for so long in the 100+ degree heat without getting that military confrontation they were lusting after.

  8. No Moongrim, I don’t want a confrontation. They think they do, but if the government keeps placating their antics as they did in the Bundy case, it will continue and grow until it becomes a huge issue. It needs to be stopped now before it snowballs out of control and many more, especially innocent people are injurred or killed.

  9. As an example; France placated Germany until Germany eventually knew France would not resist and invaded. At some point you have to stand up for the rule of law and take action. If not you will be bullied into submission.

  10. These “Oath Keepers” show their true belief system repeatedly. Instead of supporting the constitutional right for protestors to peacefully assemble and resisting the illegal police action of denying this right to the primarily African American protestors, they show their racist mindset by making aggressive moves towards the protestors and supporting the police state.

    By supporting seditious persons instead of making citizens arrests and turning the traitors over for prosecution, they prove that they care nothing for defending the constitution from all enemies foreign and DOMESTIC and believe that they have the right to break the law without punishment.

    Arresting traitors for sedition is no more antagonistic than arresting violent drug dealers. If these traitors fail to disarm and a violent confrontation does take place it would be their own fault for committing acts of sedition, resisting arrest, and even domestic terrorism. Traitors make poor martyrs.

  11. Take ’em down. The whole idea of armed insurrection is bullshit. AR15s against Apache gunships? Give me a break.

    If might makes right, then like all bullies, they only get to bully others until someone kicks their ass. THEN they understand “might makes right”.

    Armed confrontation means blood spilled – anywhere. It isn’t wanted by any law abiding citizen… BUT… Why should we worry about the message being sent to scofflaws? What is the message being sent to those of us who choose to live and support the rule of law? What are we supposed to think when we let this continue?

    Gee, they might become martyrs? They already are. Finish the job. Scofflaws need no justification to flout the laws of the land. They cannot be dissuaded from their twisted reality. It may be a sad state of affairs, but might still makes right.

  12. arresting them and convicting them of felonies strips them of their gun rights…

    sometimes even the NRA is right… if we enforce the laws already on the books dumbasses wouldn’t have guns…

  13. Oath Keepers: Militia Movement in the Obama Era.

    Bernie or Hillary will get the same thing if they win it all……

  14. We’ve gotten a lot more bloodshed dealing in the coin that these drama queens demand.

    How many have died as a result of Craven Bundy’s escapade?

  15. It was a mistake to let the Bundy mob get away with their little insurrection. They should have been given 24 hours to either surrender or send the women and children out and then a siege should have started. Letting these scum get away with breaking the law sets a very bad example and just encourages others of their ilk. And, do you people really want us to be disarmed with nutcases like this owning guns?

  16. I live in Oregon. Near those where those retards ‘demonstrated’.

    Like the WBC- if they don’t get any attention they go away.

  17. I see the republican mind(?)set is strong in you.

    “a violent confrontation does take place it would be their own fault”

    No, it wouldn’t be theirs alone. You don’t fight idiots by fighting them on their terms.

  18. I’m not saying we don’t do anything. I’m saying that we don’t dance to their tune.

    They want an armed confrontation. Don’t give it to them.
    Like the other Oath Kreeper ‘insurgencies’ after they’ve been sitting on their overly wide butts they’ll quietly go back to collecting their welfare checks at home, after nothing happens.

    Let me remind all of you Gung-Ho types- what is it that is going on here? A couple of nimrods too damned lazy to fill out paperwork.
    Not that may not be important to you and your pride- but I can guarantee you if blood is spilled over it, the Oaf Keepers will make it a banner cry.

    Do not confront these vidiots in their ‘finest hour’. Wait until they’ve gone home with their tails tucked between their legs and they’re sleeping off their consolation binge.

  19. The response requires cool, deliberate thinking. Have you forgotten Waco? I’m sure it’s being dealt with. I’m not sure it’s worth the effort though. The guy will hang himself eventually.

  20. …maybe it’s bein’ a Navy Vet; but it seems to me taking ’em down HARD is our only choice, as giving in to traitors is unthinkable…I am NOT talkin’ about another Waco…I think a Specforce raid at oh-dark-hundred would minimize casualities, and show ’em that Sedition and Treason is NOT a right…
    …I was bullied most o’ me life; and know the ONLY way to get a bully to leave me alone is to take ’em down hard…{After the Navy, a local bully in Southern Illinois tried to pull the “Dominate the Neighborhood” bit…when he attacked me I delivered a diagonal kick to his right knee…he discovered it’s impossible to dominate ANYBODY on crutches!!!}

  21. Moongrim,

    Blood thirst? Not even close. BUT… Vacillation doesn’t get it either. The idiots are defining the rules, not us. We already HAVE rules. We just have to have the courage to uphold them. Perhaps negotiated settlement would be possible if both sides wished to negotiate. But that isn’t the case here.

    THEY are betting might makes right. Either we call the bet or fold. Yammering on and on sounds good, almost righteous, but belies a solution that upholds law. Either we support the law or we don’t. It’s really just that simple.

    BTW, if I could rid this country of guns, I would. But with these idiots? They would be brandishing swords and machetes

  22. it doesn’t require lethal force… it requires overwhelming force…

    that means twice as many armed Feds as there are dumbasses…

    if the dumbasses choose to shoot then they get shot… as someone else pointed out… its no different than taking down a violent drug gang…

    Waco is a sort of red herring in this… David Koresh and his followers made poor decisions that got a lot of people killed… by their OWN choice… the thing I remember about it most is that their poor decisions got a lot of kids killed thru no fault of their own…

    the legacy of Waco and Ruby Ridge is now the government is afraid to use force even when it may be required…

  23. Moongrim,

    Here are the options as presented to us by this group of so-called “peacekeepers”.

    We either support and enforce rule of law in this country or we accept armed militias dictators under threat of armed violence.

    No one here WANTS violence, but some of us accept the terms of the “peacekeepers”. If violence is the solution, then no matter how distasteful, get on with it. I realize it is a damned if you do, damned if you don’t situation, but there isn’t any way to nuance a gun barrel pointed at your head.

  24. Bullshit!

    Whose head is the ‘guns’ being pointed at? All you’re doing is attempting to escalate before anything has happened.

    They WANT us to escalate. Stare their asses down. There is no need for us start shooting before they have.

    We all know they’re trigger happy. Don’t give them the excuse they’re looking for.

    Like the Craven Bundy flub up. We didn’t escalate. We let them stew. And the only thing that got hurt was some pride.

    So which is more important? Lives? Or Pride?

  25. If they shoot first- then yeah go after them.

    But until they do, stare them down.

    And no- Waco and Ruby Ridge are NOT red herrings. Because both were the motivations for the Murrah Building Bombing. Remember how many innocents died because of McVeigh?

    And for what? Koresh and his guns? They could’ve arrested him during one of his many dining outings. Instead they chose to confront him on his own turf.
    And Ruby Ridge- Some F.I.B. agents pee-pees got demeaned.

    They’re trying to intimidate us into doing something. It’s similar to the Planned Parenthood Video B.S. They’ll twist and they’ll edit, but if we don’t do anything first then all they’ll have is more B.S.

    But if we confront first- we’ll never hear the end of it. And Republicans in Congress will play this up worse than Benghazi.

  26. It is NOT just that simple. Nothing ever is.

    And yes this IS bloodthirst. Put that gun down and THINK!

    We confront them now- and every one of them now with their camera video phones will be recording it. and subsequently twisting it into another PP video.

    Like Craven Bundy- all we gotta do is wait for them to either A) get tired of being in the woods, or B) let them pull the first boner.

    They shoot first- then all bets are off.

    But if we shoot first- you can bet your retirement pension that the Republicans WILL NEVER let go of it.

  27. This is actually a reply to Moongrim above. If the Bundy situation had been stopped with arrests of the seditioners, we wouldn’t be having this issue now.

  28. Moon grim,

    Soooo…Would you like to drive up to their roadblock buttressed with guns and try to stare them out of your way? Think that staring at them will clear the road?

    I get all your arguments against violence, but you’re in an untenable position when faced with a potential gunfight. Umm… unless you’re ready to become the first martyred victim of “he tried to stare ’em down”…

  29. We need a f**king confrontation. These bast**ds only understand one thing. If we don’t do something now, they will be much worse later. I’m a peace-loving liberal, but there are times when you just gotta’ do what ya’ gotta’ do. Screw those America-hating dirtbags. Send in our armed soldiers and see how long these militia b**ches last. I personally have had it with these a**holes.

  30. You cant send in the Armed forces. Its against the law
    18 U.S. Code § 1385 – Use of Army and Air Force as posse comitatus
    Whoever, except in cases and under circumstances expressly authorized by the Constitution or Act of Congress, willfully uses any part of the Army or the Air Force as a posse comitatus or otherwise to execute the laws shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than two years, or both.

  31. The problem Rick, is just like the Bundy situation we’ve got a whole bunch of armed to the teeth with an itchy trigger finger Dirty Harry wannabes, right now.

    Attempting to arrest now, like then, would’ve escalated very rapidly.
    We would’ve had another Waco/Ruby Ridge. And look how well that worked out.

    No. Violence is NOT the answer. Not For Iran. Not for these Oath Kreepers.

  32. What do you think we will accomplish by kissing these people’s a**es? That is why they think a liberal won’t stand up for anything. Screw those jerks, come down on them, and come down hard, that is all they know. there is a time to pacify, and there is a time to fight. We are looking at what is trying to take over our country, they have to be stopped, not matter what it takes.

  33. Fine.

    Then I volunteer.

    When it comes to staring them down-all you gotta do is wait. They can threaten and bluster all they want.

    But until they do something irreversible- like shoot, they’ve not done anything worth shooting at them first, for.

  34. What are you talking about? I don’t believe you today. I usually like to read your comments, but there is not diplomacy with these dimwits, what part of that don’t you understand?

  35. How many bullies do you know got the Conservative Media waiting in the wings and salivating for the opportunity to make the Government Look like the Bullies?

    Y’all talking about violent escalation because of a testosterone pissing match.

  36. I am talking about not giving these morons what they want.

    They WANT an armed conflict. They WANT to be Martyrs for the Cause against the Big Bad Government. This mine is just an excuse for them.
    Where the FARK did you get the notion I’m talking about diplomacy?
    I’m talking about not dancing to the tune they’re playing.

    There is a difference. Pull your head out.

  37. So your answer is to take a page from the Republicans’ book of War Mongering?

    Yeah they’re trying to take the country, but meeting them on their terms will just make it easier for them to do so.

    Why can’t you get the concept through your skull? Don’t play by their rules!

    Go against their weakness. Not their strength.

  38. They have done something wrong, they are blocking access to public land, land they don’t own. I just don’t understand your thinking today. I am as peaceful a person as you could ever meet but sometimes, we are forced to do things we don’t like. The violence will be up to them, but they need to be told to leave NOW.

  39. From your words- You are NOT a Peace Loving Liberal.

    You’re just like the Bu$h crowd: Eager to salvage your pride through other people’s blood.

  40. It’s not warmongering Moon, it is standing up for our rights not to have people stealing our public land and thumbing their noses at us. You sometimes just have to take the bull by the horns. I’m a very peaceful person, but enough is enough.

  41. No shit they’ve done something wrong. But how in the 9 non-existent hells is blocking land supposed to warrant bloodshed?

    I think they KNOW it’s time to leave.

    No one is forcing us to act like them. Don’t lower ourselves to their level.

    We’re civilized- let’s act like it.

    In Oregon I get to encounter a whole shit load of U.S. land that’s been blocked off by morons. My solution is to find another way, go someplace else, or go home.

    I don’t pull my gun out in anger or frustration.

  42. It’s good to see SOMEONE understands the situation.

    What with the Testosterone fog we’ve got going on in the commentary section.

  43. You’re arguing from an incorrect premise. No one that I’ve read here, including myself, has said to just go in there all gangbusters and shoot them down. We are saying that we have to make them stand down, if there is any violence, it will be started by them, and they will have to live with the consequences of their actions.

  44. Yes it is warmongering.

    Like Bundy, like the sugar mine in Oregon, they’re not gonna stick around forever.

    All we gotta do is wait their whiny asses out.
    If they escalate shit- we escalate back.

    The Greatest Test of Power- is the ability to not use it.

  45. It is useless, I’m done arguing with you. You’re not even paying attention to what you’re saying. Should a cop just say well, I have this warrant for this guy for burglary, but if I try to arrest him, he will resist and I might hurt him in the process, so I’m just gonna’ let him go. You’re not making sense.

  46. We need a f**king confrontation. These bast**ds only understand one thing.

    No one that I’ve read here, including myself, has said to just go in there all gangbusters and shoot them down.

    Your words TerryLF. You’re an ass.

  47. For this to be an argument- you’d have to be paying attention to what I’m saying.

    You’re not.

    What are you gonna do? Shoot me?

  48. Then STFU and listen to what I’m saying Terry!

    If the burglar wants to resist by shooting at the cop- then by all means blow his ass away Mr. Cop.

    To carry your analogy- The Burglar has staked out a position and is daring the cop to come and do something about it. The burglar is heavily armed and is considered dangerous.

    So, do we go in like so many Cops do and use a flash bang grenade that may end up in some kid’s crib?, and end up killing a whole bunch of folks? (and for what exactly?).

    The burglar has a whole passeload of fellow burglars who feel they’ve got a right to burgle. And they’re waiting nearby with videocameras to record the “Gestapo”.

    The burglar needs to eat, to sleep, to use the bathroom.

    Mr. Burglar is going to be more stressed the longer it plays out.

    5 people died as a result of not invading Bundy’s ranch.

    86 died because of invading the Waco Compound.
    http://www.freedommag.org/english/vol29i1/page08x.htm

    You do the math.

  49. Congress has destroyed the notion of the Rule of Law by clogging courts with obviously unconstitutional rules passed in the name of religion.

    This is why elections matter. The small elections – judges, DAs and Governors. Legislators are property managers. They think themselves kings and princes. We allow it.

    We refuse to educate our children. We allow fer to rule our lives – fear of the government we pay for. We get the government we demand.

  50. Moongrim, I’m going to have to go with Rick on this one. He is correct in his analogy of France and Germany and the willingness of the British to knuckle under to the Germans. As far as the Maginot line, it was a static defense emplacement that was obsolete during it’s very construction and was useless because the Belgians never finished the barrier. We DO have to stop these militias before they ignite a race war which is EXACTLY what they are thirsty for. We must take them down before they grow in strength OR this entire nation will be on big WACO…

  51. We DO have to stop these militias before they ignite a race war which is EXACTLY what they are thirsty for.

    I agree- but not by playing into their hands. If we go into that mine in Lincoln Montana with guns a blazing- and you know it’ll happen- our cops are no better than Ferguson Cops, we’ll create an incentive for a War.

    And how exactly is a mine supposed to incite a race war?

  52. It most certainly NOT an either or situation! We have non-lethal options open to us. We are smarter than they are. We ARE better than they are.

    Let us act like we’re more civilized than they are.

    So- they have an armed militia dictatorship around what? A mine? How in the Hades does that threaten the United States?

  53. There is nothing sweet about a month-long dispute between gold miners and the Bureau of Land Management over the surface rights at Sugar Pine Mine.

    Initial reports of an armed standoff were overblown according to sources within the mining community. However, armed members of Oath Keepers, which consists of active and former military and law enforcement officials sworn to uphold the U.S. Constitution, have kept a security presence at the mine near Grants Pass, Ore. since April 9.

    Meanwhile, BLM officials have called for a peaceful, administrative solution to the dispute.
    http://www.goldprospectors.org/News/News-Details/ArtMID/636/ArticleID/92/BREAKING-NEWS-Gold-Miners-BLM-clash-over-mining-claim-in-Oregon

    A PEACEFUL ADMINISTRATIVE SOLUTION. What a freaking concept!

    Body count as of August 14, 2015: ZERO.

  54. Lets not forget, the Bundy “militia” brought their “women” to hide behind if fired upon. Some even brought their children to hide behind. They’re nothing but crazies that congregated at this thieves’ property.This group also produced 2 coward cop killers. This group of whackjobs oppose background checks cause none of em would pass and would lose their guns, hence “the govt coming to take our guns” propaganda.

  55. Moongrim,

    I applaud your appeal to reason and logic, but that appeal carries with it the assumption that reason will prevail – which isn’t part of the peacekeeper MO.

    Further, I once again will point out that “staring them down” sets (another) precedent that encourages more “peacekeeping”.

    You are correct to point out that all the militias are watching. Waiting them out only serves to inform them that they can get away with ignoring the law. That is a bad precedent and a very slippery slope.

    Your comments about testosterone, blood thirsty, etc. is over the line and below the belt. Self righteousness isn’t a good approach. There is no good answer to any of this. Uphold the law, sir. Uphold the laws of this land.

  56. very nice… I like that everyone here is so literate..

    you realize of course that the quote works both ways…

    its just as easy for the Oath Keepers to follow the strategy as a course of action as it is to urge the government to follow it…

    just because they act like dimwitted thugs doesn’t mean they aren’t literate too…

  57. Infest the land they are on with bees.

    Release thousands and thousands of bees!!

    Let them get stung. (Only trying to make light here)..we for the most part are all peaceful people on here.

    It is the frustration that gets us to say, go get’m. I don’t have any answers..don’t give them what they want. Use reverse psychology like one would do on children. Tell them the land is all theirs..and they have to maintain it..

    I don’t know..then there would be no challenge for them.

    Or..let the bees take care of it!

  58. A’ho Rmuse! Thank you for bringing more to light! None of the Native American Indians can get involved or it would be prison or death. Better solution? Give back all the government lands & parks to the Native American Indians & the land would be better managed. Besides it was their lands. Your Friend Cloaked Cherokee! #CherokeeStrong WADO!

  59. Don’t these cretins have jobs? They have time to do this stuff while everyone else is working for a living?

    We are all probably supporting them by paying OUR taxes. They are lazy, ignorant, $#)@*.

  60. And understands history…

    The best way to make “them” stop and go away “permanently” could easily be done by a crack team of psy-ops professionals. It would be easy, very, very easy to “play with their heads”.

    Play with their heads until they pee in their pants any time the words “Oath Keeper” and “Bundy” is used in the same sentence.

    “Play with their heads” until they are left in a state of mind where all they can do is stare at a wall all day, won’t go near a cell phone, computer, vehicle (computer) or anyone associated with a gun or communication device…all they’d have left in their mind is a way to plan a way to “escape” from American or else the military-grade flying green monkeys will find them…

    All it takes is a simple mind control “recipe” based on their own particular brand of paranoia and fear; let’s see how they like being infected with a “crazy” virus that they have no mental immunity to fight off…

  61. Ignoring the growing threat posed by armed extremist groups in this country will only make the problem worse.

    An armed confrontation between the U.S. Government and the radical Right is a foregone conclusion; and if these groups don’t manage to incite the sympathy-generating Waco-style clash they’re hoping for, some of them will simply start shooting at the Feds in some isolated place like backwoods Montana, and then simply blame the government for starting the gunfight. It won’t matter what the actual truth is, since those folks who adhere to the crackpot principles of the anti-government Right will believe whatever propaganda they’re fed by the leadership of far-Right groups.

    Better to move against these nuts now, or we’ll be dealing with thousands more of them after another Democratic president is elected next year, and they’ll be angrier and even more radical by then….

  62. Cut off their water supply, like is done to the poor people in Detroit. If they want the water back on, once they leave the land it will be on for them. These idiots are pure evil, that is why there is a stand still. They don’t belong in a civilized society, they cannot assimilate. At the same time, they are getting away with breaking laws, and intimidating people. There is no good answer. What would POTUS do?

  63. Let me see if I can put my arms between the two of you for just a moment…

    True Believers who are cultist, political or religious or both, are coerced by their leaders to die for their belief system; it is part of all cult rituals. Destructive cults will use any means to garner attention and get themselves on the radar of authorities (laws, police, military, ect).

    The most successful way to end their madness is to either give them their apocalyptic battle or “feed” the followers/let them in on “reality”. Creating doubts and show them the lies and tricks used against them, how much money they’ve been fleeced, etc. That plus, using their own techniques to undo the mind control (you play liberal talk radio on a speaker 24-7, send a “Tokyo Rose” to soften the blow that there is no way out,
    surrender, over and over until a few crack, then a few more, until there are few left to confront the leader who happens to have clean clothes, food, money, comfortable quarters. A fight ensue…

  64. But, and it is a big but, if this was a group of American Indians, especially from a tribe from the region (& who probably have more right/claim to Federal lands than these Yahoos) or God forbid people of color, you know those people (African Americans): The Yahoos would be demanding blood & the Government would send in troops with weapons to remove by force & if a few people die – well that’s the price you pay. Icing on this cake, if a few of the Gov Forces are wounded & killed, the leaders of the group would be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and serve time not only for sedition, but for murder.

    However, these are a bunch of white males so they are handled differently. Patriots my eye, nothing more than homegrown terrorists.

  65. Moongrim, I understand where you are coming from. The problem is the follow through. These Yahoos get away with doing whatever they want without consequence. Not that the Government should go in with guns blazing, but the Gov. needs to ID these “patriots” & after they think they have gotten their way & put away their weapons, arrest their butts and charge them with sedition. ID the leaders and make sure they pay a bigger penalty for inciting sedition & block free & easy access to public lands. That these lands belong to all the people of the US not just people who want to use the land as a money making venture.

  66. …GD it Moon!!! When are you gonna learn to agree to disagree??? Not all Liberals and Progressives concur with your peace-at-all-costs philosophy…many o’ us are Veterans and see this as something to use psyops or a SpecForce type raid to take these treasonous bastards down!!!
    …I understand your position, {the Navy didn’t steam-burn ALL o’ me brain cells} but it’s a two way street!!!

  67. They’re hillbillies, not too smart, and I agree cooler heads will prevail. WHEN they get their due, they should be made to wish they were never born. ?

  68. Had the Bundy Taliban been Black ppl or anything black,they would have used their military weapons but, they have been intimidate and there is no limit to what the Bundy Taliban does. Gov’t acting like creme puffs and they do not stand for anything and that’s why we,the American People have to fall for this b.s.

  69. They are MORE than dim-witted thugs–they are fanatics waiting for leadership to tell them how to amplify their efforts to “bleed the beast”…so far, they haven’t been able to grow/recruit like ISIS because, they are so marginalized steeped in arrogance, so aberrant toward everyone who won’t by into their extreme belief system; they are equally frustrated no one takes their heavily subsidized weaponized operation seriously…OK’s are a joke.

    All it takes is a single, chaotic, random political/religious “act” to triggers their reaction and set them off into a spiral of events to which there is no return (classic Waco–all systems closed off to all outside influences in order to start Koresh’s doomsday).

    Let Oath Keeper cultist refuse all negotiations, let them fire 1st, and, make sure every part of their “stand off” is videoed by as many people as possible. Only then will they be properly defined as ISIS style domestic terrorist and the law can do what they want with them…

  70. Why not bring the police dept from Ferguson, or Texas, or South Carolina or… and tell them the miners et.al. are black.

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